Einstein's Relativity and Everyday Life -- Clifford M. Will

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Bhanwara said:
If I take 6 months and become an expert in Differential
Geometry so I can take apart all the various GR proofs,
will that work get published? Who will understand my proofs?
Those who do, will make nonsensical dishonest claims that my
proofs are not valid. Nobody else will understand what
or why, so they will have to take the word of the
acknowledged experts.
Click to expand...


Well you could try, but I doubt you will. Its sat pretty high and dry
so far. But hey, best of luck on the Nobel prize I say.

But don't be offended when I say, as others, that we won't hold our
breath.

--
The greatest enemy of science is psuedoscience.

"Time is pseudo-directional because randomness is always pseudo-random..."
Jeff revolutionises physics in sci.physics.

"Now there's two stuck naysay lose cannons and a third sick puppy on the way."
Brad tries to reason with the voices in his head...

"General Relativity is a Tower of Babel that wastes time, money and minds on
such pursuits as time travel, worm holes, gravity waves.."
Tom saves us from ourselves and badly written scifi.
 
Bhanwara said:
Who will understand my proofs?
Those who do, will make nonsensical dishonest claims that my
proofs are not valid. Nobody else will understand what
or why, so they will have to take the word of the
acknowledged experts.
Click to expand...
So what would be the point
in trying to give it more complex work that nobody impartial
can understand, when even the work that most people can
easily understand doesn't raise an honest stir?
Click to expand...

This leads to a couple of thoughts, which will be my first and last on
this topic, I expect:

1) What if Einstein had taken such a defeatist attitude before
publishing his revolutionary ideas, and

2) It would be well for you to understand how Einstein gained acceptance
for his ideas, and follow a similar path.

Oh, THREE thoughts...
3) And if, in doing the above, you should happen to be unable to gain
acceptance for your ideas, it would be a really good idea to learn from
the peer review process, rather than dismissing it as invalid.

He dicho,
 
It appears, that Tim,
like many "weirdos" <sic> , "loonies" and "nutters"
has been conditioned to believe
all of the GTR Urban Legends.
Click to expand...

Hey, don't knock the conditioning. It took years of
hard work to earn my indoctrination certificate. So
there's no point telling me to use my mind - as I
already said, I'm on the inside of the physics
conspiracy.
It is interesting to see that Tim
is ignorant of the fact that a simple law
discovered by Galileo over 200 years ago,
Click to expand...

For a second I thought your Galileo comment was a
reference to the European navigation system currently
being built. Being a European myself (as you will have
noticed from my English spelling), I wondered if the
European Space Agency is also part of the Relativity
Theory conspiracy?

I also wonder what Galileo (who lived some 400 years
ago, and before Newton) had to say about orbiting
atomic clocks.

-Tim
 
Bhanwara said:
If I take 6 months and become an expert in Differential
Geometry so I can take apart all the various GR proofs,
will that work get published? Who will understand my proofs?
Those who do, will make nonsensical dishonest claims that my
proofs are not valid. Nobody else will understand what
or why, so they will have to take the word of the
acknowledged experts.
Click to expand...

HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA

Do you honestly think you can learn all the math required for
differential geometry AND differential geometry itself in 6 months? I
can't help but wonder what your mathematical background is if you think
you can write proofs without math and believe you can learn
differential geometry in 6 months.
You don't believe that?

Well, I think my explanation of light transmission in vacuum is
something nobody came up with before -- do you see people
citing my website all over the place? Where is the discussion
of the implications of that? My explanation of the electron
gun causing anomalous behavior is something nobody came
up with before -- where are the implications discussed?
Click to expand...

Have you considered the possibility that nobody is citing it beacuse it
is crap?
Or does all of that get disproved by some satellite data
that matched some convoluted mathematical hackery?
Click to expand...

Remind me...what is your background in mathematics? Do you even have a
solid grasp of calculus?
The treatment of vacuum-light-transmission and
electron-gun and proposed-MMX-explanation proves
to me beyond a shadow of doubt that the establishment
is not where it should be. So what would be the point
in trying to give it more complex work that nobody impartial
can understand, when even the work that most people can
easily understand doesn't raise an honest stir?
Click to expand...

Nobody cares what you think of the establishment because you are too
much of a kook to be impartial yourself.
 
| [email protected] wrote:
| > It appears, that Tim,
| > like many "weirdos" <sic> , "loonies" and "nutters"
| > has been conditioned to believe
| > all of the GTR Urban Legends.
|
| Hey, don't knock the conditioning. It took years of
| hard work to earn my indoctrination certificate. So
| there's no point telling me to use my mind - as I
| already said, I'm on the inside of the physics
| conspiracy.
|
| > It is interesting to see that Tim
| > is ignorant of the fact that a simple law
| > discovered by Galileo over 200 years ago,
|
| For a second I thought your Galileo comment was a
| reference to the European navigation system currently
| being built. Being a European myself (as you will have
| noticed from my English spelling), I wondered if the
| European Space Agency is also part of the Relativity
| Theory conspiracy?
|
| I also wonder what Galileo (who lived some 400 years
| ago, and before Newton) had to say about orbiting
| atomic clocks.
|
| -Tim

Hmm... Probably the same thing Einstein said about them.
After all, he reckoned that one based in Antarctica would run
faster than the ones NIST use in Colorado, so you should join his
Flat Earth Conspiratorial Executive Society (FECES) as well.
http://www.androcles01.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/Clockgain.JPG
European trolls such as yourself are called tusselader.
http://www.trollshop.net/trolls/tusselader/
Androcles
 
The said:
news:[email protected]...
Click to expand...
|
| I also wonder what Galileo (who lived some 400 years
| ago, and before Newton) had to say about orbiting
| atomic clocks.
|
| -Tim

Hmm... Probably the same thing Einstein said about them.
After all, he reckoned that one based in Antarctica would run
faster than the ones NIST use in Colorado, so you should join his
Flat Earth Conspiratorial Executive Society (FECES) as well.
http://www.androcles01.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/Clockgain.JPG
Click to expand...

Well if the one in Antartica was higher above sea level then the NIST
one.....

--
The greatest enemy of science is psuedoscience.

"Time is pseudo-directional because randomness is always pseudo-random..."
Jeff revolutionises physics in sci.physics.

"Now there's two stuck naysay lose cannons and a third sick puppy on the way."
Brad tries to reason with the voices in his head...

"General Relativity is a Tower of Babel that wastes time, money and minds on
such pursuits as time travel, worm holes, gravity waves.."
Tom saves us from ourselves and badly written scifi.
 
Phineas said:
But it takes far less hacks then the Newtonian case...

--
The greatest enemy of science is psuedoscience.

"Time is pseudo-directional because randomness is always pseudo-random..."
Jeff revolutionises physics in sci.physics.
Click to expand...
 
Dirk Van de moortel said:
Yes, but I think he prefers horses:
http://users.telenet.be/vdmoortel/dirk/Physics/Fumbles/HorseAss2.html
http://users.telenet.be/vdmoortel/dirk/Physics/Fumbles/HorseAss.html
Click to expand...

It is interesting to see that Dork Moortel
suggests that it is better to get one's information
from a horse's ass,
rather than from the horse's mouth.

That explains a lot about the quality of his posts.

Hopefully everyone will read the two "fumbles"
listed by Dork, and decide for themselves
what kind of information is best for them.

--
Tom Potter
http://home.earthlink.net/~tdp/
http://tdp1001.googlepages.com/home
http://no-turtles.com
http://www.frappr.com/tompotter
http://photos.yahoo.com/tdp1001
http://spaces.msn.com/tdp1001
http://www.flickr.com/photos/tom-potter/
http://tom-potter.blogspot.com
 
Phineas T Puddleduck said:
LOVE the website btw. A nice little reminder to keep on my toes to make
sure I don't end up in there ;-)
Click to expand...

As I pointed out:
"Parrots of the feather.."

"Phineas T Puddleduck" will fit in just fine with
Dork Moortel, Sam Wormley and Erik Max Francis.

--
Tom Potter
http://home.earthlink.net/~tdp/
http://tdp1001.googlepages.com/home
http://no-turtles.com
http://www.frappr.com/tompotter
http://photos.yahoo.com/tdp1001
http://spaces.msn.com/tdp1001
http://www.flickr.com/photos/tom-potter/
http://tom-potter.blogspot.com
 
Phineas T Puddleduck said:
And if you'd actually read the link I provided.. you'd know the
corrections are continual due to the fact the clocks are at different
rates. But then you're in denial. Sqwawk
Click to expand...

Read my post about how the GPS system works Dumbo,
and you'll see that I point out that the clocks are
updated on a continuous basis.

Apparently, Dumbo is trying to make a case that
these corrections are required because of General Relativity effects
rather than because of chemical, electronic and Quantum Mechanical effects.

--
Tom Potter
http://home.earthlink.net/~tdp/
http://tdp1001.googlepages.com/home
http://no-turtles.com
http://www.frappr.com/tompotter
http://photos.yahoo.com/tdp1001
http://spaces.msn.com/tdp1001
http://www.flickr.com/photos/tom-potter/
http://tom-potter.blogspot.com
 
Phineas T Puddleduck said:
I've nearly finished my Masters in it.

Cool resume Erik.

I get yours. Pretty basic misunderstanding of physics I'd expect from a
high school student.

Quite possibly...


You really have a parrot fetish don't you. Norwegian Blue?
Click to expand...

It is interesting to observe that
after I pointed out that Dork Moortel was a "horse's ass",

he set up a personal attack web site and
claimed that my suggesting that it was better to get ones information
from the horses mouth, rather than from a horses ass (Like Dork),
was a "fumble", and that I had an ass fetish.

Now that I have pointed out that "Phineas T Puddleduck" is a parrot,
I dare say that when he sets up his personal attack web site,
that he will feature me, and try to neutralize his parrot image,
by asserting that I have a "parrot fetish".

Defense mechanisms are so predictable.

--
Tom Potter
http://home.earthlink.net/~tdp/
http://tdp1001.googlepages.com/home
http://no-turtles.com
http://www.frappr.com/tompotter
http://photos.yahoo.com/tdp1001
http://spaces.msn.com/tdp1001
http://www.flickr.com/photos/tom-potter/
http://tom-potter.blogspot.com
 
Sam Wormley said:
When it comes right down to it, Potter, respects my posts,
but won't admit it!
Click to expand...

Well, let's say that there is a lot of energy (Actually action)
exchanged between us, and that it keeps the blood circulating.

--
Tom Potter
http://home.earthlink.net/~tdp/
http://tdp1001.googlepages.com/home
http://no-turtles.com
http://www.frappr.com/tompotter
http://photos.yahoo.com/tdp1001
http://spaces.msn.com/tdp1001
http://www.flickr.com/photos/tom-potter/
http://tom-potter.blogspot.com
 
Sam Wormley said:
That gets my goat too, Potter. You should be more skeptical
like a scientist--research the empirical data supporting
modern physics. Watch out, Potter, you might learn something
new!
Click to expand...

I now see where Sam and I differ.

Sam puts emphasis on the "empirical data supporting modern physics"
and I put emphasis on the "empirical data" that has the highest
correlations between causes and effects,
and effects that have the most affect my environment.

For example, I don't put a lot of emphasis on models
that dabble in astrology, time travel, worm holes, space warps, and the
like,
as dabbling in these things are a waste of time, money and minds.

A mind is a terrible thing to waste.

--
Tom Potter
http://home.earthlink.net/~tdp/
http://tdp1001.googlepages.com/home
http://no-turtles.com
http://www.frappr.com/tompotter
http://photos.yahoo.com/tdp1001
http://spaces.msn.com/tdp1001
http://www.flickr.com/photos/tom-potter/
http://tom-potter.blogspot.com
 
Phineas T Puddleduck said:
The hacks such as Perihelion precession which accurately describe orbital
motion you mean. But I suppose I must remember that any sufficiently
advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic.

In your case, even a stick must seem amazing.
Click to expand...

Everything to me is amazing.
Most amazing to me is the fact that
many people have been brainwashed to
have a cult-like devotion to certain models and personalities.

Keep on hacking, (Patching your cult beliefs.)
and keep on parroting, (Your cult beliefs.)
as long as it makes you feel secure.

Considering that "Phineas T Puddleduck" claims
to be a "stick" expert,
hopefully he will explain to me the differences between

1. a stick,
2. the time interval between the stick extremities,
3. and the time interval * C?

--
Tom Potter
http://home.earthlink.net/~tdp/
http://tdp1001.googlepages.com/home
http://no-turtles.com
http://www.frappr.com/tompotter
http://photos.yahoo.com/tdp1001
http://spaces.msn.com/tdp1001
http://www.flickr.com/photos/tom-potter/
http://tom-potter.blogspot.com
 
Phineas T Puddleduck said:
For the last year I did an reasonably indepth analysis of the Newtonian
and GR orbital motions. I could provide you with a pdf if you'd like, its
got a lot of info on how the standard conic sections predicted by
Newtonian gravity yields a plethora of open forms in GR.

Like the idea of dwell time, and how perihelia precession in the solar
system is a consequence of modelling its motion as a simple harmonic
oscillator and examining the difference between radial periodic motion and
the periodic motion of the perihelia.

I also investigated analytically this procedure, as well as coding it.

Now to any GR expert its pretty beginning stuff. But the point is - I've
done it, and its patently obvious k00k you haven't even tried to do the
math around GR
Click to expand...

"Phineas T Puddleduck" makes a good point.
I "haven't even tried to do the math around GR"

And I "haven't even tried to do the math around" astrology.

And I "haven't even tried to do the math around" feng shui.

But I have tried and DONE the math that involves real world things
like complex data gathering and control systems and the like.

It doesn't take a rational, intelligent, non-suggestible, person long
to come to the conclusion that some models like General Relativity,
astrology, etc.
are a waste of time, money and minds.

People who are knowledgeable in stress analysis know that
General Relativity was a rip-off of the use of tensors
which came into use in the late 1800's to solve
stress and strain problems.

Back in the 1960's Greer Ellis, Bill Bean and
I used to hold stress analysis seminars
for stress analysis grunts like Sam Wormley.

Einstein tried to use the methods of the stress analysis people
to model the whole universe from the outside looking in,
but if you accept the fact that sentient beings exist,
and that you are one, and that sentient beings
can play with forces and levers, and affect their environment,
General Relativity is a sick joke.

It is an effort to look at the universe with the mind
of an omniscience God, rather than from the point of view
that one lives in a universe co-occupied by other sentient beings.

People who are hung up on General Relativity are
generally weak, powerless folks with inferiority complexes,
and they tend to be paranoiac and have delusions of grandeur.
Pretending to possess powerful, esoteric knowledge gives them
a feeling of security.

A mind is a terrible thing to waste.

--
Tom Potter
http://home.earthlink.net/~tdp/
http://tdp1001.googlepages.com/home
http://no-turtles.com
http://www.frappr.com/tompotter
http://photos.yahoo.com/tdp1001
http://spaces.msn.com/tdp1001
http://www.flickr.com/photos/tom-potter/
http://tom-potter.blogspot.com
 
Sam Wormley said:
Either way you've got it wrong Potter... your numbers are just
plain wrong whether talking about chip rates or bit rates. As
I said, Potter, you don't have a clue about the basic operation
of GPS as is demonstrated in these newsgroups!
Click to expand...

Well Sam,
why don't you give the readership the benefit of your
superior intelligent and knowledge
by engaging in debates on issues,
rather than by making dogmatic assertions,
nit picking typographical and other trivial errors,
attacking messengers,
posting references that you obviously haven't read,
etc.?

Better yet, why don't you use your esoteric knowledge of
that wonderful tool General Relativity,
to work out a few real world examples.
to show the folks how powerful it is?

And why don't you comment on why correlators are
so important to the GPS system, and why it is DESIRABLE
but NOT essential to offset the GPS oscillators,
in order to demonstrate your comprehension of the system?

--
Tom Potter
http://home.earthlink.net/~tdp/
http://tdp1001.googlepages.com/home
http://no-turtles.com
http://www.frappr.com/tompotter
http://photos.yahoo.com/tdp1001
http://spaces.msn.com/tdp1001
http://www.flickr.com/photos/tom-potter/
http://tom-potter.blogspot.com
 
Tim said:
Hey, don't knock the conditioning. It took years of
hard work to earn my indoctrination certificate. So
there's no point telling me to use my mind - as I
already said, I'm on the inside of the physics
conspiracy.


For a second I thought your Galileo comment was a
reference to the European navigation system currently
being built. Being a European myself (as you will have
noticed from my English spelling), I wondered if the
European Space Agency is also part of the Relativity
Theory conspiracy?

I also wonder what Galileo (who lived some 400 years
ago, and before Newton) had to say about orbiting
atomic clocks.
Click to expand...

It is interesting to see that Tim does not know
that Galileo experimented with pendulums,
and discovered that their periods
were affected by gravity.

And apparently Tim did not know
that in the 1700's England sent people all over the world
with standard pendulums to count the swings from sunrise to sunrise,
and apparently Tim does not know
that Newton used this data to compute all kinds of things about the Earth,
shapes, sizes, altitudes, tides, etc.

I urge Tim to read some of Newton's and Galileo's works
and gain a better understanding of the history of science.

And he might also read the works of Doppler
and see how the time periods in moving bodies
are observed from various points.

--
Tom Potter
http://home.earthlink.net/~tdp/
http://tdp1001.googlepages.com/home
http://no-turtles.com
http://www.frappr.com/tompotter
http://photos.yahoo.com/tdp1001
http://spaces.msn.com/tdp1001
http://www.flickr.com/photos/tom-potter/
http://tom-potter.blogspot.com
 

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